People mad at me for following Orders
Apparently some people are mad at me for reporting griefing. First of all see rule #3. Griefing is not allow in Darklands and Nether. People get a ban for doing so. Uncovery's rule not mine. Second of all Uncovery has asked to be informed on the griefing. I do what he asked.
See the following post on what Uncovery said. http://uncovery.me/forums/topic/griefing-enderchest-in-darklands/ EWhen is was found out on who did it, that person got a ban.
See the following on what Uncover said on people fencing their lots so people could not cross. http://uncovery.me/forums/topic/problems-walking-to-lots/
See the following on what Uncovery said on another darklands griefer. http://uncovery.me/forums/topic/darklands-portal-has-been-grieffed/
See the following on what Uncovery is doing about the darkland griefing. http://uncovery.me/forums/topic/more-griefing-in-darklands/
His words exactly "Btw by now I consider the darklands spawn as some kind of honeypot. If people think they can do the obvious, then I will find them now and ban them, undo the damage and we move on. If it becomes too frequent, we will have to see how we move on."
More on Griefing http://uncovery.me/forums/topic/grief-report-time-again-and-sleepystrangekid-caught-them-in-action/
I have been asked to post when I find griefing. Uncovery wants to know when it is done. He gets a read and bans the person doing it. When several of us fixed what was griefed Uncovery said in the last post not to fix it. He will undo what gets griefed.
So for those that have given me - Karma for reporting you need to think about this. Uncovery wants the griefing reported. Uncovery wants to ban the griefers. Uncovery has asked for griefing in nether and darklands be reported. So if you are mad at me for reporting then you are mad at me following orders that came from Uncovery. He did not say for me to email him. He said post in the forum. So to get mad at me for following orders is like getting mad at Uncovery.
I am not responsible for those that grief getting a ban. They knew that it is not allowed and yet they still do it. It is in the rules. See rule #3. If they did not read it then they should of. I should not catch grief or - Karma just because I follow that Uncovery asks. I should not catch grief or - Karma because someone decides to break the rules and gets a ban.
Uncovery has never told me not to post the griefing. So if you have a problem with me reporting what he wants me to report then take it to him. If you have a problem with the rules then take it to him. If you have a problem with griefing not being allowed on the server then take it to him. But to take it out on the messenger because you are too scared to voice you option to Uncovery well that is just sorry.
Another thing. People get mad at me for saying, "read website" to people that ask questions and the answers are on the website. I use to give the answers but then Uncovery told me that he rather people read the website. In fact read the second paragraph on the rules. Also read rule #11. I do not want to get a ban so I do what Uncovery asks. So before you get mad at people read the website and read the forums on what Uncovery says.
And on the posting in the forums. Uncovery never told me to email him. I do not even has his email.
For those that get mad at me for being hard on griefers on their posts. Well in case you did not know griefing is very bad. Yes minecraft is just a game. But people put in a lot of time and hard work and for someone to just come and destroy that, well I have no pity on the griefers. They did it for fun or to take items because they were too cheep or lazy to get their own mats. For them to post "Oh I did not know I was griefing." They knew. Even if they did not know it was in the rules they would be stupid to think it was OK to destroy what others build. I do not believe any of them said that they was sorry for damaging someone' s building.
Until Uncovery tells me other wise I will continue to watch the Darkland's spawn area and report to him when it gets hit. I will say that when I see little things missing I do fix it and not report it. I only report the big problems or stuff that keeps happening. Like when someone kept taking the enderchest. For those that do not know for a few months it kept getting taken. Sometimes 3 to 4 times in a week. One day it was taken 5 times in one day. When I reported it Uncovery asked that I let him know when it got taken again. When it was and the person got a ban the chest stopped dissapearing.
I wish I would of taken pictures of the last big grief. 2 people did it. It looked like the spawn area was hit by several bombs. They were caught in action and ban. Several of us worked 3 hours on fixing the area back with our own supplies.
So if you defend the griefers then you are no better them. If your lot got griefed I do not think you would say, "Oh it is OK. Do what you want." No you would be screaming for them to get a ban.
Wait wait wait.. lets back up. This whole conversation started because someone was asking why you have -karma. You were blaming it on Owl and his son (whether that is where it came from or not I don't know). You said that you wished people would tell you why they didn't like you instead of giving you negative karma. Scar answered you and said maybe because you tend to write forum posts rather than email Unc to tell him of griefing. The thought was that perhaps if you emailed him quietly that things wouldn't turn into a public argument and that the forums wouldn't be so emotional. No one said they didn't like you because you report griefing or because you follow the rules. I don't claim to know what Unc thinks, feels or wants but I do recall him saying to report griefing in the DL but not to worry that he would fix it.
My personal take on you is that you tend to take the rules to an extreme. You are kind of like the kid at school who asks for homework. Its not that its wrong behavior, its just that some people are put off by it. I don't have much desire to cheat and I would NEVER take or grief something intentionally so please don't try to stick me in a category of "those griefers" or people who want to cheat. I haven't given you negative karma, and I won't, but you were saying that you wished people would speak to you. Over all our opinion of you is really none of your business as your opinion if me is none of mine. I'm sure there are lots of people around who don't like my silly airhead type banter but meh.. whatever. This forum post is probably very close to what some people are frustrated by. Something that happened in game, now in public view, for everyone to choose a side ect.
I understand you wanting to protect the server and to keep out the bad guys but sometimes its just.. too much. I don't dislike you personally its just the behavior that can be irritating.
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Like I said. Uncovery never told me to email him. He said to post in the forums. I also do not have his email address. Yes I did say for people to let me know if they are mad at me. But for people to get mad at me for what Uncovery asked is not right. Also when people see griefing in the darklands they tend to tell me. I am not going to look the other way and say oh don't worry about it. When people ask for my help I help. People have been griefed on their own lots and ask me for help. I am not going to say too bad you are on your own. I try to help when asked.
I have a right to defend myself when I get bashed for posting on griefers.
I may be a bit hard on the griefing in Darklands but I help get it to where it is. I do not want to see it destroyed. I was part of that project. See how happy you are when someone griefs something that you worked hard on. I am not going to say "Oh I understand. It is OK." No I am going to be harsh on them.
Vixen is doing all of us a big favor. I personally hate griefers and feel that they're the biggest concern in SMP.
If you cant read the rules, then its your fault for getting yourself banned. There is not need to get mad at others just because they've reported you and got you banned.
kddk, that wasn't the issue brought up in chat. i agree with you completely.
If you ask most people why they like this server, the answer is overwhelmingly "community." Griefing is one way to hurt the community. Hostile words, self-righteousness, and arguments do damage too. Even if one feels they're in the right, they damage the friendly mood and vibe of the server.
Removing griefers from a server is good. They're like warts. But there's a big difference in collateral damage between removing a wart with a scalpel, and removing a wart with a rocket-launcher.
I imagine most of the darklands griefers aren't subhuman scum hell-bent on the destruction of humanity. They're probably just a few stupid kids doing what kids do, acting stupid. Having something you built destroyed is disrespectful and feels like a violation Our server is better off without them, but rooting them out comes at a cost of increasing overall hostility on the server.
We have a super advanced lot protection system for personal (empire) and communal (kingdom) buildings. (not to mention all the other worlds) Before people started building so heavily in unprotected areas, we had only very rare and easily solvable issues with griefing. Most of those potential offenders would have gotten a lot, built a quiet and uneventful little plot, got bored, then moved on. Sure, there were a few obnoxious texters. But they were dealt with quickly and without much consequence.
Nobody thinks having griefers on a server is a good thing. But personally, I think we should consider the costs associated with rooting them out in the current tone and method. Especially when there are well established, peaceful, and grief-proof ways, of building which have established and grown our wonderful close-knit community for the last two years.
Just my 2 cents.
This server prides itself on the very low ammount of griefing and theft. If these rare occurances happen and keep going unreported, then the ammount of griefing will increase because people notice that we have stopped checking up on it and punishing those guilt of such an act. One of the main function of the forums is to report players breaking the rules. Because unc can't always be right there to get on and stop them when someone emails him, but if there is a public post, a master or elder could get on and stop the accused.
I agree wholeheartedly, Sockso. Also, when it comes to reporting griefing, a simple description and coordinates are all that is needed. Arguing about bans and appeals needs to stop both on the forum and in-game chat. If a banned user starts a thread asking for an appeal or explanation, ignore it and let it get buried under more meaningful content. This behavior only encourages destructive actions when potential griefers see that they'll be able to get a rise out of people if they start messing around.
ok guys, let's do the following then:
If you see griefing or anything else you object to, please submit a ticket. that way we can avoid that the people who find stuff are demonized for being hard on others etc.
Remember that in the end I made the rules and I decide what is to be done, if it's a ban or not. Not the person who reports something.
Further:
I would like to get rid of the drama here. To clarify:
- I do not give orders. I ask people to do stuff. This is not the military, it's a game.
- Nobody is supposed to be the server police. I do not expect people to run around and "try to find the bad guys". If you see something bad happening, I expect you to report it. But I do not expect anyone to spend time to patrol the server to find something that nobody knows about yet. You are here to play and have fun. If you are paranoid about griefers or other issues and start to search & report every broken glass pane in the darklands, stop that. 5 redstone lamps, sure, that's an issue we better tackle. But do not be a self-proclaimed justice league.
I agree wholeheartedly that Silver is one cool dude!
Went to bed last night thinking about this. I usually try to think of both sides. I did not think about the friends the griefers made before they got a ban when I bashed them. I am sorry for those that I offended on that. I was mad at people griefing an area that I help make and thought only of venting my anger on them and that was not right. There has been a lot of griefing in that area the past 2 weeks and I let it get to me and should not have.
Would Silver like a cup of coffee?